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PALESTINIAN WRITER KARIM KATTAN AND LEBANESE HISTORIAN YARA EL
KHOURY: “THE CATASTROPHE IN GAZA IS IRREVERSIBLE. THE FUTURE IS
TERRIFYING”  
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Inès Gil
November 29, 2024
Equal Times
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_ There are lines that cannot be crossed in Western countries, an
established consensus that must be respected, and a vision of history
that must be upheld – otherwise, the entire intellectual and moral
edifice would collapse. _

alestinian writer Karim Kattan and Lebanese historian Yara El Khoury
offer two perspectives on Israel’s current wars.,

 

Although a fragile ceasefire was called in Lebanon was called earlier
this week, the civilian death toll in Palestine and Lebanon continues
to rise daily, with millions displaced and living in dire conditions.
In the Gaza Strip in particular, Israel’s Western allies have done
nothing to stop the violence. More than 43,000 Palestinians have been
killed – at the very least – and Israel’s blockade has caused a
humanitarian disaster unprecedented in the 21st century. Yet, this had
failed to provoke the widespread outrage one might have expected from
the leaders of the world’s major powers. In Lebanon, since the
outbreak of open conflict between Israel and Hezbollah on 23
September, the majority of casualties have been civilians, with the
death toll now approaching 1,900, according to AFP and the Lebanese
Ministry of Health. Fearing that no boundary will be off limits, the
Lebanese are now asking themselves a grim question: will they suffer
the same fate as Gaza?

Two intellectuals, one from Palestine and the other from Lebanon,
share the experience of their countries being bombarded by
Israel. Karim Kattan [[link removed]], 35, is a Palestinian
writer from Bethlehem. He holds a PhD in comparative literature and
currently lives in France. He has published two novels, along with
numerous articles in French and English literary journals. Yara El
Khoury is a Lebanese historian, a lecturer at Saint-Joseph University
in Beirut, and an associate researcher at the Centre for Modern Arab
Studies (CEMAM).

In this joint interview for _Equal Times_, they share their views on
two countries devastated by war and the largely absent outrage in the
West.

KARIM KATTAN, THE WAR IN GAZA FEELS EVER-PRESENT, YET, DESPITE THE
HUMANITARIAN NIGHTMARE UNFOLDING, IT HAS BEEN MET WITH OVERWHELMING
SILENCE AND PASSIVITY. PEOPLE ARE TALKING ABOUT GAZA, BUT ARE WE
TALKING ABOUT IT THE RIGHT WAY?

KARIM KATTAN: First and foremost, I want to clarify that my focus is
primarily on the French context, as I live in France. The war has been
going on for over a year, and I continue to see a clear disregard for
the Palestinian experience. There has been no real collective outrage,
especially among writers. I naively believed that writers—men and
women alike—might be moved to protest the destruction of libraries
and the massacre of fellow writers in Gaza. Yet even in this area,
which should have resonated with them, there has been no outcry. In my
view, this is largely due to the constant suspicion cast on the work
of Palestinian journalists, who are the only ones covering this war.

ARE WE WITNESSING THE DEHUMANISATION OF PALESTINIANS IN GAZA?

KK: Dehumanisation implies that, at some point, we were granted
humanity but lost it through some nefarious process. In reality, after
a year of systematic destruction in Gaza, I’ve come to realise that
we have never truly regarded the Palestinians as human beings –
‘we’ meaning Westerners. I didn’t use the term before the war in
Gaza but my perspective has shifted.

YARA EL KHOURY: We are confronted with deeply entrenched and
conflicting memories between the West (including Israel) and the
Middle East. We don’t view history through the same lens.
Palestinians have indeed been dehumanised. What’s worse, there are
many in Israel who deny the very existence of Palestinian history, as
if this people never existed in the first place. The events of 7
October have been interpreted anachronistically. They have been
referred to as the first pogrom of the 21st century, even though the
context is vastly different from the conditions that Jews faced in
Tsarist Russia. Western media are amplifying the narrative of an
‘existential’ battle that the Israeli army is supposedly fighting,
when, in fact, since its founding in 1948, Israel has won every battle
it has fought. Israel is in a position of conquest, yet we are being
made to believe it is on the defensive. I don’t think this serves
the Israelis themselves, and it certainly won’t move forward the
dialogue that, sooner or later, will need to take place.

HAVE PALESTINIANS BEEN FORGOTTEN BY THE VERSION OF HISTORY TOLD IN THE
WEST?

YK: Yes. To this day, the West remains convinced that Palestine was
empty and impoverished before the creation of Israel, and that it was
the Jewish settlers who performed miracles by transforming arid land
into gardens. This is a distorted view. The prosperity that made
Lebanon the ‘Switzerland of the Middle East’ in the 1950s and
1960s was, in part, due to the Palestinians who settled there after
being expelled from their towns during the Nakba [the mass expulsions
that took place during the 1948 war, which lead to the creation of the
state of Israel, editor’s note]. Where did these Palestinians, with
capital and education, who became key figures in the vibrant economic,
cultural, and intellectual life of pre-war Beirut [Lebanese Civil
Wars: 1975–1990], come from? They couldn’t have come from a
desert...

YARA EL KHOURY, DO YOU THINK THE WEST IS INDIFFERENT TO THE FATE OF
THE LEBANESE PEOPLE AS WELL?

YK: Lebanon is viewed differently from Palestine; its sovereignty is
recognised, and it enjoys significant sympathy in the West. As a
result, incursions by the Israeli army tend to provoke more outrage
than those in Gaza and the West Bank. It must also be acknowledged
that the Lebanese themselves (and I count myself among them) never
believed they could suffer the same fate as Gaza. It seemed insane,
unthinkable. Today, many believe they are caught in a war that is not
their own, fighting for a just cause – the Palestinian cause – but
one for which they have already paid a very heavy price over the last
50 years. There is a feeling that history has abandoned them, a sense
of loss and disillusionment. For a long time, they waited for Israel
to withdraw from southern Lebanon, which it did in 2000. They waited
for the Syrian army to leave, which happened in 2005. So why is it
that we’re still at war?

KARIM KATTAN, FOR SOME, THE STORY BEGINS ON THE 7TH OF OCTOBER. BUT
WASN’T THE VIOLENCE AGAINST PALESTINIANS ONGOING AND WIDESPREAD,
EVEN BEFORE THAT MASSACRE?

KK: The refusal to acknowledge Palestinian suffering is not new, but
it has become glaring over the past year. There is a clear reluctance
to view what’s happening in Israel-Palestine within a material,
historical, and political context. Many journalists have failed in
their duty to provide critical analysis and context. I am constantly
asked why the voices of Palestinians are being repressed. But the real
question should be directed at Europeans: why do the established media
shut down almost any consideration of the Palestinian issue? I am all
the more astonished because I naively believed in the possibility of
dialogue. I didn’t use to say this, but the truth is there is
censorship in France. This is worrying for us, but even more so for
the French people.

THE CREDIBILITY OF PALESTINIAN JOURNALISTS HAS BEEN CALLED INTO
QUESTION, AND THEY ARE SOMETIMES ASSOCIATED WITH HAMAS. HOW DO YOU
EXPLAIN SUCH SUSPICIONS?

KK: There is a colonial mindset that underpins much of French thought,
one that gives rise to a deep skepticism of Arab perspectives. When
reporting on the number of Palestinians killed by Israel, Western
media constantly repeat phrases like “according to the Ministry of
Health, which is administered by Hamas, a terrorist group,” in a
supposed attempt at neutrality. But what they fail to mention is
crucial: this information cannot be verified by other media outlets
because Israel prohibits journalists from entering Gaza. In this
context, and because Palestinians in Gaza are not being heard, my
voice – coming from Paris – has found greater resonance in the
media. As a writer, I tend to focus on the long view, on
contradictions and hesitations. I exist in a discursive space that is
not always aligned with the media narrative, but I still feel
compelled to speak out about what’s happening. It’s a double-edged
sword, though, because I’m expected to speak on everything. I find
myself rediscovering roles I never anticipated: political scientist,
historian, international law expert. Palestinians are expected to
possess a wide range of expertise in order to offer a valid
perspective on the Israel-Palestine conflict.

YARA EL KHOURY, IS THE REPRESENTATION OF THE ISRAELI NARRATIVE IN THE
PUBLIC SPHERE JUST AS PROBLEMATIC FOR THE LEBANESE?

YK: There are lines that cannot be crossed in Western countries, an
established consensus that must be respected, and a vision of history
that must be upheld – otherwise, the entire intellectual and moral
edifice would collapse. This is deeply problematic and stifles
critical thought. But what I want to say to Karim Kattan is that,
fortunately, he is able to speak out, even if it seems insignificant
to him. For a long time, the problem for the Arab world was that its
voice was silenced. But since 7 October, especially in the
English-speaking world, we’ve heard voices from the Arab world
speaking out loud and clear. The Arab world has regained a voice that
was taken from it for so long. And that gives me hope.

KK: That’s true. There’s a huge difference between the
French-speaking world and the English-speaking world when it comes to
the discourse on Gaza. Many Palestinians are English speakers, which
is probably the main reason. But in my opinion, Palestinians also face
another challenge. Many intellectuals produce exceptional work, but we
are fragmented. A Palestinian in Gaza, a Palestinian in the West Bank,
a Palestinian from 1948 [Descendants of Palestinians who remained
after the creation of the State of Israel and now hold Israeli
passports], an internally displaced refugee [Palestinian refugees
within occupied Palestinian territory], and an externally displaced
refugee [Palestinian refugees outside of the Palestinian territories,
the majority of whom reside in Lebanon, Jordan and Syria] each have
different resources and realities. These varying realities lead to a
fragmentation of thought.

THE WAR IN GAZA HAS BEEN ONGOING FOR OVER A YEAR, AS IT HAS BEEN IN
LEBANON, WHERE IT ESCALATED ON 23 SEPTEMBER. EVERY DAY, DOZENS OF
PEOPLE ARE KILLED BY THE ISRAELI ARMY, AMID GROWING INDIFFERENCE. ARE
THE PALESTINIANS AND THE LEBANESE RUNNING OUT OF TIME?

YK: Yes. If the war continues at this pace, there will be nothing left
in Gaza, southern Lebanon or the southern suburbs of Beirut. Even if
the fighting in Lebanon were to stop tomorrow, the problems caused by
the war are catastrophic. Across the region, we have paved the way for
a hundred years of future conflict. As for Lebanon, it seems lost, and
the outlook is extremely bleak.

KK: Israeli society is entering an era of extreme uncertainty, not
only for those around it, but also for itself. The future terrifies
me. The catastrophe in Gaza is irreversible. Even if a ceasefire were
to be declared today, Gaza would remain uninhabitable. What will
become of the generation of Palestinians whose lives have been
shattered? Leaving aside the wounded, which Europeans seem to regard
as incidental, what about the Palestinian children who have missed a
year of schooling? Entire future generations have been wiped out. This
will shape Palestinian society in a profoundly negative way for a long
time to come. The outlook is dire.

This article has been translated from French.

_Inès Gil is a French freelance journalist currently based in
Lebanon, after having worked in Israel and the Palestinian territories
for two years. In August 2017, she travelled to Mosul to cover the
developments in Iraq in the aftermath of the war against the so-called
Islamic State. More recently, she covered the Beirut port explosion
(August 2020) and the war over Nagorno-Karabakh (October 2020)._

_Equal Times is a trilingual (English, French and Spanish) global
news and opinion website focusing on labour, human rights, culture,
development, the environment, politics and the economy from a social
justice perspective._

* Palestine
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* Israeli Occupation
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* Nakba
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* Lebanon
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